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Sound Magic

Isn't she utilizing Sound Magic via her Ocarina? --Neffyarious (talk) 13:38, January 8, 2019 (UTC)

The way understood it, the ocarina is the one creating the magic effect, similar to how erza uses her lightning empress armor or bisca uses her guns, they did not lightning magic or gun magic themselves but were just activating the said magical items, so ophiuchus blowing and putting air inside the ocarina just activates it magical ability. If you take away erza's armor, bisca's guns and ophiuchus' ocarina then they can no longer use lightning magic, guns magic and sound magic meaning the magic was never theirs in the first place. Lets see what the others think. LightningGeistLaxus Chibi 14:17, January 8, 2019 (UTC)

Um, Sound Magic? The ocarina, to put it mildly, allows Ophinuchus to somehow control everything physical around her, or that's how I saw it. In other words, it can be argued that she's actually using sound magic to get Natsu to punch himself - as some kind of hypnosis - and she can alter the intensity of the sound waves so it can crush the ground, which are some of the effects we saw, but also, the ocarina could conjure wind attacks and even, though a little unrelated, shoot magical beams and projectiles. I guess I believe that the Ocarina is a special Magic item on its own that has various uses and not as simple as a device used as an interface-of-sort to use another types of Magic like Erza's spears or something. But anyway we are sure that whatever Magic the Ocarina has, Ophiuchus doesn't have it herself on her own, given that the only way Natsu managed to overpower was after Happy disarmed her from the ocarina.

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 14:37, January 8, 2019 (UTC)

Oh wait, I just remembered that I think it was specifically stated that she uses it to control everything she can see, and that she also used it to control Natsu's fire itself, and not just his body XP Its been three years since I last saw this >.< HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 14:37, January 8, 2019 (UTC)

Yeah, we list Lightning Magic under Erza's Lightning Empress Armor equipment, and Erza as a user of Lightning Magic on the Lightning Magic page because of it, so I was thinking the same applied here. --Neffyarious (talk) 15:31, January 8, 2019 (UTC)

Im curious if it was confirmed that it gives the user the ability to use sound magic for the sake of reference? i always thought that it is just a musical instrument that manipulates a person, elements (such as wind, earth & fire) and create beams and shockwaves.

At first i thought that the effects alone doesnt make it clear that it was sound magic since based on what the series has shown about sound magic is that it is mainly related to creating sounds or vibrations in the air. Unless mashima is basing it on the pied piper where the user plays an instrument and manipulates those who can hear but in this case they can control not just humans bat inanimate objects too. lol LightningGeistLaxus Chibi 15:56, January 8, 2019 (UTC)

We have on the Ocarina's page "When the user plays the instrument, the sound of it can manipulate the body and movements of a person who is within the user's view.". I propose Sound Magic be added under the Ocarina in her Equipment section and that Dance of Death and Punishment of Death be added as Sound Magic spells. --Neffyarious (talk) 12:20, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

After thinking about it i think that could work too, you can follow Bisca Connell's page where her weapons are in her equipment section along with the appropriate magic and spell listed below it, and the ocarina page will be changed to follow the Magic Sniper Rifle page. Let's see what the other think. LightningGeistLaxus Chibi 15:43, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

Except that if you remember, Punishment of Death can't be sound Magic since it shoots laser beams. Yes the ocarina can manipulate the body and movements of a person, I wrote that sentence myself, but it can also manipulate fire and wind, sound can't do that and by extension Dance of Death is not Sound Magic, either.

PS A small thing that I don't know if its worth anything but I'd have preferred if you have waited at least until its clear that this is what we agreed on before making changes, slight as they may be.

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 19:17, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

It's redundant, in my opinion, to label the ocarina as Sound Magic, and Sound Magic only at that mind you, when it just explains a portion of its powers. Sound can't summon wind, can't perform pyrokinesis, I might go as far as saying it can't cause the ground to split in half but I'm aware of the stretch that by some weird logic the sound shockwave can be so intense it can split rocks XP, and finally sound can not materialize as laser beams, or anything solid or solid-like at that, this isn't Bleach. Personally I think that, due to the little info the anime provided about this item and that the ECS arc was a roller coaster anyway during its run, just having it as an all-mighty item with several powers, used just as a plot device to make Natsu struggle in his fight with Ophiuchus and then disposing of it in the most anti-climactic fashion, is much more inclusive.

Huh, two Bleach references in one message, yay me I guess...

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 19:38, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

The sounds let her control those things. The beams are a bit odd but it could be sound blasts rather than laser beams... I guess? --Neffyarious (talk) 20:50, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

Will that even be Sound Magic at this point? None of those effects match with anything the series has given so far, with the exception of the ground breaking, and saying that about the beams is speculative in my opinion.....

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 21:07, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

I assumed Sound Magic was just magic that was sound-based. We've seen it do a lot of things that aren't sound related, like kill people or hear people's thoughts, so controlling things via sound magic doesn't seem that farfetched. --Neffyarious (talk) 21:28, January 11, 2019 (UTC)

I actually see that Ophiuchus' employments are. Killing people can't really be used as an argument here since it's primarily Curse Magic and Zeref had a hand in it, and Lullbay was never really stated to be Sound Magic, the wiki listed it under Sound because it fitted, it's logical, since it's some kind of song, but it's not like it's setting the bar for everything Sound-related in the series. The hearing people's thoughts can be attributed as an extension of the action of "hearing", specifically Eric's already Dragon Slayer-enhanced hearing, and I just read that August apparently can also hear the "soul", but still I see them as somehow related to sound, fire and wind aren't and energy beams as well. Most of Sound Magic's appearances came from the anime anyway.

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 00:23, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

Well as Lightning said it could have some basis in the pied piper legend, with sound controlling things. Remove it if you wish until this discussion has concluded. --Neffyarious (talk) 00:42, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

Hmm, the idea might have originated from there, yes, and as I said above, it was merely used as a plot device to overpower Ophi to halt up Natsu, and when Natsu finally managed to get to her, he one-shotted her.

Yes, that what I was implying, that it's wiser not to change anything just yet until more people saw this and it's discussed further since we have conflicting arguments. >:3

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 01:09, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

I suppose this decision depends on how we define Sound Magic - as sound generated/utilized by magic, or as abilities used via magical sound. --Neffyarious (talk) 01:15, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

i think if we define our own definition of sound magic it will become fan made unless we base it on the official sources, but if i remember correctly sound magic is never expanded on and majority were just portrayed as creating sounds that leads to different magical effects. hopefully the others could chime in maybe we missed something. lol LightningGeistLaxus Chibi 01:21, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

Correct, Sound Magic was never canonically used in the manga, the name was never used, and aside from Lullaby, the only manga usage of it is August's, which I just knew about it an hour ago since I'm anime-only. The four known anime-exclusive spells on its page are mainly using sound as a way to inflict physical damage, or create a physical wall in the case of Erik's.

HamodyKeyes FT siteAsgail 01:29, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

Since we know that by using the ocarina, sounds were made and the effects was created so that's already a fact. Let's also keep in mind that mashima tend to make stuffs up in the manga and anime disregarding real world logic since this is all fantasy anyway, so using sounds to control fire and inanimate object might not be logical but in a fantasy setting could makes sense all because of "Magic". So i guess we can just treat it like one of erza's or bisca's items which magic and spells related to them.

So i think based on the anime, we can say that the ocarina which is a magic item like erza's armor or bisca's guns have spells in them since those spells are not possible to use without the ocarina so i guess im ok with it having spells and under sound magic.LightningGeistLaxus Chibi 02:43, January 12, 2019 (UTC)

Should we close this discussion? --Neffyarious (talk) 19:18, March 9, 2019 (UTC)

Think of it like this. Bisca’s guns and Ezra’s items consume magic power from them. Instead of magically infused items. The items they use are either ordinary items they use to make an effect. Or they use items with magic abilities that are fueled by the holder own Magic Power. Take Ezra Nakagami Armor Levy reads from a book it consumes Magic Power. While Ezra use Requip she uses the armor’s own abilities simply fueled by her own power. Bisca simply uses her own Magic Power to make her bullets magical. So Ezra instead of learning different kinds of magic. Instead uses armor with those powers. She simply has to power them with her own power.

Most Holder Magic is like Lucy’s. A magic item powered by the mage. Now there are items that are imbued with Magic and Magic Power. Such as ColorS and Loki’s Rings before he was allowed back into the Celestial World. While Requip is a Caster Magic itself, the armors are Holder Types. Less something changed. So with that said I would say she uses Sound Magic. As look at Aquarius typically she uses her Water Magic via her urn. So Celestial Spirits have items with magic as part of them. Otherwise it wouldn’t get sent back to the Celestial World when the spirit leaves.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 20:56, March 9, 2019 (UTC)

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